Let my boys shoot their Z-6!

[Val]

Your In-Game Name:
501st Commander Valiant

Suggestion:
Remove the Charge up for the Z-6

Addons Needed (workshop link):
None

Reason:
Currently, the Z-6 charge-up makes the Z-6 a lot less effective then it should be, Along with it just being glitchy, this would just make it so TC members can actually Shoot before most of them are shot dead by either NPCs or a Heavy EE

 

[Lexi]

although this is a straight buff, i think this is a fair enough change. the charge up is annoying not only for 501st but the rest of the server and i really dont think this will make them OP since the Z-6 is so inaccurate anyway. +1

 

[Kinger]

+1

 

[LoCho]

I'll start with the fact that it makes very little sense for a mini gun to instantly be at full rpm but that's all from that.

Otherwise on the 501st jobs with a Z6 you have another gun which is a good, standard gun which you can use if you need to fire quicker. I'd suggest making more use of all your equipment rather than changing something you already have that is good.

 

[Val]

I'll start with the fact that it makes very little sense for a mini gun to instantly be at full rpm but that's all from that.

Otherwise on the 501st jobs with a Z6 you have another gun which is a good, standard gun which you can use if you need to fire quicker. I'd suggest making more use of all your equipment rather than changing something you already have that is good.

Our Rifle may be good, but it isn't perfect, What ends up happening in most events is 5 TC will be on the FL pushing up but, an EE heavy or B2 will appear and by the time the Z-6s start shooting, 3 of the 5 TC will be dead, with the fourth half dead, With the DC-15A, yes, it is good, but does not have the Ammo needed for the amount of droids TC is expected to take out during an event, and while yes the Z-6 firing instantly makes little sense, we used to have it due to bypassing a bug that happened with TFA, That bug was fixed by ARCCW but now another bug with the charge-up has started to happen, With the charge-up being removed, the bug would happen a lot less often as well

 

[Rapidus]

+1

Dont think this will make much difference, charge up would make more sense for a powerful weapon. In some cases this pretty much just a “ skill issue “, as maybe just use your other equipment instead. However i dont think its worth the argument…

 

[Offender]

-1

I think its fine as it is you guys have jug suit to survive the charge up of your minigun and if the minigun takes too long for you to charge up then you do have your dc-15 that can shoot immediately

*Edit
The windup is two seconds from no firing to an instant 900 rpm.
it has the same stats as the EE minigun (375 DPS) (maybe a little less accurate
There aren't many weapons on the server that can do 640 dmg before you are able to shoot if you both start shooting at the same time
Besides a single EE should always have some kills when fighting you guys but with 3 juggs in a breach/push no EE can survive a fight against ye unless sith,B2,Droideka

 

[Tom]

The wind up becomes more of a problem in enclosed spaces when they are forced to stop shooting pretty much, it isn't crazy for them to ask as the wind up didn't exist before and it would cause less internal issues. The difference it will cause in open situations like outside in a push won't affect them much but its just enclosed spaces. So can either argue, it works in the right situations and is a bother in some bad situations or argue that it was working perfectly before and it didn't need the wind up in the first place.

 

[Rapidus]

The wind up becomes more of a problem in enclosed spaces when they are forced to stop shooting pretty much, it isn't crazy for them to ask as the wind up didn't exist before and it would cause less internal issues. The difference it will cause in open situations like outside in a push won't affect them much but its just enclosed spaces. So can either argue, it works in the right situations and is a bother in some bad situations or argue that it was working perfectly before and it didn't need the wind up in the first place.

Yet again, they could just use their other rifle. They dont have to use a minigun in every environment. Theres nothing wrong with their DC-15LE, so its easy to just switch to the rifle if the minigun is gonna be a disadvantage.

 

[Rapidus]

Just remember, theres a max of 3 Heavies allowed on the job. ( 5-6 if theres officers online ) Do we really think you need this ?

You already have such a powerful unit, i really dont think its necessary and worth the hassle. Yet again, im spouting out what i think and maybe its not true. However if the 501st legion find this an necessity, so be it.

 

[Tom]

Yet again, they could just use their other rifle. They dont have to use a minigun in every environment. Theres nothing wrong with their DC-15LE, so its easy to just switch to the rifle if the minigun is gonna be a disadvantage.

Overall DPS difference does not make it worth to switch out. DC-15LE has 45 bullets with 35 damage rounds with the RPM being 450 meaning per mag they can do 1.5k damage if all bullets connect compared to the Z-6 which has 200 bullets with 25 damage rounds with the RPM being 900 meaning per mag they can do 5k per mag. This doesn't include the RPM into the calculation just yet but obviously it is 2x faster, and does 3.3x more damage per mag.

 

[Val]

-1

I think its fine as it is you guys have jug suit to survive the charge up of your minigun and if the minigun takes too long for you to charge up then you do have your dc-15 that can shoot immediately

*Edit
The windup is two seconds from no firing to an instant 900 rpm.
it has the same stats as the EE minigun (375 DPS) (maybe a little less accurate
There aren't many weapons on the server that can do 640 dmg before you are able to shoot if you both start shooting at the same time
Besides a single EE should always have some kills when fighting you guys but with 3 juggs in a breach/push no EE can survive a fight against ye unless sith,B2,Droideka

Yet again, they could just use their other rifle. They dont have to use a minigun in every environment. Theres nothing wrong with their DC-15LE, so its easy to just switch to the rifle if the minigun is gonna be a disadvantage.

the EE one has no wind-up and an extra 50 rounds, The jug suit is good at absorbing damage but then an EE heavy comes out of nowhere from behind and shoots us We have to turn and charge the Z-6 up, and by that time, even with jug suits, the majority are dead before we shoot them, An EE sniper can also 2-3 shot jugs, depending on which one it is, the normal HT with its S-6 shotgun can kill a jugg in 2 shots, most NPCs have high damage and decent HP but are low in numbers, making most of us die from them as well, if we have no medics, which most of the time we don't have any, a JT EE can just fly around and dodge the Z-6 and rifles. The entire point of TC or any Spec in a regiment is to offer a different play style and unique equipment, if a SGT just joined TC they will use the Z-6 more than the rifle because they want to have fun and do something different, This is part of why the suggestion was made: Most TC aren't having fun anymore due to the charge up returning, my own XO prefers his duel DC-17s over the Z-6 due to the charge up. B2 2-3 shots jugs like snipers, sith insta kill pretty much and droideka just destroys them, almost all my Officers don't use the Z-6 due to the charge-up, this suggestion is to see get used more often, I know people dislike it because it doesn't work that well RP-related and because its a Buff, but one Major point of the server is to have fun, this suggestion makes TC fun to play again and I will admit this now, 501st is not a powerful unit, you could compare it to ever other FL Regiment and its weak in comparison, 212th get Vehicles, RPS, Thermals along with a jumpack, most of GM get a very good SMG, Detonators and Flamethrowers along with Ghook, then 501st has a DC-15,bubble shield [which is not on the TC Jobs] and then the TC Equipment, we are currently the weakest FL Regiment, this would just make us it at least more on par with the others

 

[LoCho]

The unique thing about 501st is that there is nothing unique about it. This means you shouldn't really be outstanding at anything and you serve the purpose of being the average. This means you should be able to tank slightly more than most but server the purpose of shooting enemies, not EEs specifically, not NPCs specifically, just enemies.

When you compare this to other regiments that you mentioned, 212th are meant to deal with other vehicles and deal lots of damage to both EEs and NPCs with the downside of being a massive target for any weapon especially explosives. This means when targetted they will feel shit and die like you guys when you get attacked specifically by an EE. GM specialise is CQC and NPC/area denial this means they have an SMG which does piss all mid-long range but is brilliant when used close range, a flamethrower to stun lock NPCs and clear rooms (with some sacrifice) and the thermal dets and flame nades which can be used to control choke points in a CQC defence.

However if you are intent on getting some kind of buff to the TC jobs and Senior Jobs to counter the lack luster feeling of charge up I would personally suggest removing the heavy suit from the regiment and replacing it with an armour value on the jobs. This means you can still move while keeping the damage reduction.

 

[Offender]

the EE one has no wind-up and an extra 50 rounds, The jug suit is good at absorbing damage but then an EE heavy comes out of nowhere from behind and shoots us We have to turn and charge the Z-6 up, and by that time, even with jug suits, the majority are dead before we shoot them, An EE sniper can also 2-3 shot jugs, depending on which one it is, the normal HT with its S-6 shotgun can kill a jugg in 2 shots, most NPCs have high damage and decent HP but are low in numbers, making most of us die from them as well, if we have no medics, which most of the time we don't have any, a JT EE can just fly around and dodge the Z-6 and rifles. The entire point of TC or any Spec in a regiment is to offer a different play style and unique equipment, if a SGT just joined TC they will use the Z-6 more than the rifle because they want to have fun and do something different, This is part of why the suggestion was made: Most TC aren't having fun anymore due to the charge up returning, my own XO prefers his duel DC-17s over the Z-6 due to the charge up. B2 2-3 shots jugs like snipers, sith insta kill pretty much and droideka just destroys them, almost all my Officers don't use the Z-6 due to the charge-up, this suggestion is to see get used more often, I know people dislike it because it doesn't work that well RP-related and because its a Buff, but one Major point of the server is to have fun, this suggestion makes TC fun to play again and I will admit this now, 501st is not a powerful unit, you could compare it to ever other FL Regiment and its weak in comparison, 212th get Vehicles, RPS, Thermals along with a jumpack, most of GM get a very good SMG, Detonators and Flamethrowers along with Ghook, then 501st has a DC-15,bubble shield [which is not on the TC Jobs] and then the TC Equipment, we are currently the weakest FL Regiment, this would just make us it at least more on par with the others

to Answer that give it a higher mag size to make it more viable to prefire

 

[Rapidus]

the EE one has no wind-up and an extra 50 rounds, The jug suit is good at absorbing damage but then an EE heavy comes out of nowhere from behind and shoots us We have to turn and charge the Z-6 up, and by that time, even with jug suits, the majority are dead before we shoot them, An EE sniper can also 2-3 shot jugs, depending on which one it is, the normal HT with its S-6 shotgun can kill a jugg in 2 shots, most NPCs have high damage and decent HP but are low in numbers, making most of us die from them as well, if we have no medics, which most of the time we don't have any, a JT EE can just fly around and dodge the Z-6 and rifles. The entire point of TC or any Spec in a regiment is to offer a different play style and unique equipment, if a SGT just joined TC they will use the Z-6 more than the rifle because they want to have fun and do something different, This is part of why the suggestion was made: Most TC aren't having fun anymore due to the charge up returning, my own XO prefers his duel DC-17s over the Z-6 due to the charge up. B2 2-3 shots jugs like snipers, sith insta kill pretty much and droideka just destroys them, almost all my Officers don't use the Z-6 due to the charge-up, this suggestion is to see get used more often, I know people dislike it because it doesn't work that well RP-related and because its a Buff, but one Major point of the server is to have fun, this suggestion makes TC fun to play again and I will admit this now, 501st is not a powerful unit, you could compare it to ever other FL Regiment and its weak in comparison, 212th get Vehicles, RPS, Thermals along with a jumpack, most of GM get a very good SMG, Detonators and Flamethrowers along with Ghook, then 501st has a DC-15,bubble shield [which is not on the TC Jobs] and then the TC Equipment, we are currently the weakest FL Regiment, this would just make us it at least more on par with the others.

I understand your point of view, however there really isnt a problem with your equipment. Your just used to an easier setting if that makes sense, you just need to make use and try make your methods more affective instead of relying on a minigun needing a 2 seconds charge… It really isnt that difficult. If you want your combat to be more affective then use strategy, not just your equipment, there IS ways you can use your equipment more affectively. If your having trouble with charging up your minigun, switch weapons. Its like the saying “ Switching weapon is faster than reloading “

Also TC will not always be able to fight every opponent type, such as JT, cause JT is more of a WP or ARC thing. They have the equipment to deal with those sorts of enemies. Your spec/regiment however is meant to deal with large numbers of NPCs or perhaps EE Heavies. Same thing goes for Snipers, if your getting hit just find cover and try let GC handle that, Its that simple. No offense but i shouldn't need to explain these sort of strategies to a regiment CO. Yes the point of this server is to have fun, but sometimes you need accept defeat, your not guaranteed to stay alive the whole event. Just to learn to accept the death and keep fighting, besides you ARE the FL, dont expect to plummet your way through without taking a fall. Valiant your are doing fantastic on the BF, as someone who uses EE alot, i can tell you for a fact that your men do excellent work fighting againsts EEs and NPCs. You really dont need to change anything

Its a matter of evolving from the change.

 

[Kojima]

My biggest issue with the charge up is the fact people run in front of TC nearly 90% the time, this isn't fully on the person running in front of them, its just that the TC is slower than your average sloth as they're tanky, but currently we also have a bug where if you cancel the charge and start charging again, your gun won't shoot, so half the time you're waiting about 2 seconds to realise your gun is bugged, another 2 seconds for the game to see you've stopped charging and then another 2 seconds to charge up and start shooting again but due to how common people get in front of you it happens nearly every time you engaged in combat.

I have put a bug report up and awaiting the issue to be resolved from the devs however I don't know if the bug can be fixed and removing the charge up time would be easier (If the bug was fixed I wouldn't have a major issue with it (Still annoying as everything on TC has time increased to start combat) but wouldn't be the end of the world)

Z-6 weapon fire bug

Description of Bug: Z6 fails to shoot on charge up when cancelling on first wind up How to replicate: Charge the Z6 twice in a row (Variable) without shooting can stop the gun from firing

multiverse-gaming.uk

 

[Painite]

Would like to say that the only reason the TFA Charge Up was removed was because TFA was laggy.
And this was explained for when we go to ARCCW is that charge up will be implemented again.

Charge up is fair - 501st have a 900RPM minigun that has 200 rounds.
The DPS Including reload - is very high due to this (Higher than GMs repeater.)

Once ARCCW V2 is released, the issues with charge up may be fixed.
And just to add on, the comments within this post is making the charge up worse than it really is.

It's 0.9 of a second...
Removal of the charge up will mean that 501st will excel in CQB as well (Debatably better than GM).

I've written this very rushed though if you would like me to expand feel free to say.
---------------------

Just to add on but the people who get this gun, get a lot of survivability.
So just to top it off..........

The average DPS on the server is 262.5 DPS (Not Including Reload).
Current State Z-6 (When charged up) - 375 DPS
GM Repeater (Designed for CQB) - 425 DPS.

Gun does not need altered....
My HP has been demolished from fighting a singular Juggernaut with a Z-6.

 

[Jensen]

Glad to see 501st still don't make any good suggestions.